Shark Wars

Discuss and distribute tools and methods for modding. Moderator - Grognak
shark
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Re: Shark Wars

Postby shark » Fri Nov 09, 2012 11:53 pm

neither the borg cube nor the other ship look particularly interesting or good in-game... :/
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Kieve
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Re: Shark Wars

Postby Kieve » Sat Nov 10, 2012 12:55 am

Whale Cancer wrote:I hope you aren't including the Obsidian Cruiser in your download, I know (99% sure) Kieve does not people redistributing like this (your comment is unclear to me whether it is included or not).


This is 100% correct. Not to be an arse but I don't want my work being altered and redistributed without my express approval. I'm glad you enjoy the mod but I don't consider it "promotion" as much as I do "theft" (ie. stealing original work to include in your own mods).

EDIT:
So I downloaded the mod to see what was going on under the hood, and found this.

Code: Select all

<!-- 
   ***********************
   My ships buahah

   fed B - deathstar
   kestel B - imperial sharkdestroyer
   rock B - phlegeton
   engi B - obsidian

   ***********************
 -->

<!-- 
   ***********************
   engi, layout B - obsidian cruiser
   ***********************
 -->
<!-- ENGI SHIP -->
<!-- LAYOUT = ALT -->
<!-- SHIP ID = ???? -->
<shipBlueprint name="PLAYER_SHIP_CIRCLE_2" layout="obsidian_cruiser" img="obsidian_cruiser">
   <class>Obsidian Cruiser</class>
   <name>Retribution</name>
   <unlock>To unlock this Engi ship you'll need to get to the 5th sector.</unlock>
   <desc>No one knows who created this intimidating vessel, but it's bound to make the Rebels think twice about taking you on!</desc>
   <systemList> 
      <pilot power="1" room="9" start="true" img="room_pilot_KRS"/> 
      <doors power="2" room="2" start="true" img="room_doors_6"/> 
      <sensors power="1" room="5" start="true" img="room_sensors_3"/> 
      <oxygen power="1" room="0" start="true" img="room_oxygen_5"/> 
      <engines power="1" room="1" start="true" img="room_engines_2"/> 
      <shields power="2" room="8" start="true" img="room_shields_7">
         <slot>
            <direction>up</direction>
            <number>1</number>
         </slot>
      </shields> 
      <weapons power="4" room="15" start="true" img="room_weapons_5"> 
         <slot>
            <direction>right</direction>
            <number>1</number>
         </slot>
      </weapons>
      <drones power="2" room="10" start="false" img="room_drones_3"/> 
      <medbay power="1" room="11" start="true"/>
      <teleporter power="1" room="13" start="false"/> 
      <cloaking power="1" room="3" start="true" img="room_cloaking"/> 
   </systemList>
   <weaponSlots>4</weaponSlots>
   <droneSlots>3</droneSlots>
   <weaponList count="2" missiles="0">
      <weapon name="KRS_GRAVBOMB"/>
      <weapon name="KRS_DISRUPTOR_1"/>
   </weaponList>
   <aug name="ROCK_ARMOR"/>
   <aug name="CRYSTAL_SHARDS"/>
   <health amount="30"/>
   <maxPower amount ="9"/>
   <crewCount amount = "2" class="crystal"/>
   <crewCount amount = "1" class="rock"/>
   <crewCount amount = "1" class="engi"/>
   <shieldImage>obsidian_cruiser</shieldImage>
   <cloakImage>obsidian_cruiser</cloakImage>
</shipBlueprint>


"My ships"? Additional rock-armor augment to Obsidian, and additional rock crewmember? I get enough complaints about the ship being OP as it is, and your blueprint comments seem to suggest the cruiser is in fact your work, so you can imagine how unhappy I am at the moment.

Had you at least attempted to contact me about the usage, I might feel more flattered, but as it stands you took my work, altered it and repackaged it (which I very explicitly said I did not want done), and threw it in with all these other modifications with no visible credit given?

Remove my work from your mod. This is non-negotiable.
Grognak
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Re: Shark Wars

Postby Grognak » Sat Nov 10, 2012 1:52 am

Hi Shark. Due to a request I have removed the download link from your first post. Please get approval from any individuals you took assets from before re-uploading your mod.

Thanks and feel free to pm me any questions.
shark
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Re: Shark Wars

Postby shark » Sat Nov 10, 2012 2:45 pm

Sometimes I'm glad I'm this stubborn with a thick skin...

@Kieve:
You can get butthurt all you want Kieve, I really appreciate your work but I do not appreciate your 'omg omg you cannot download an image of my ship from a zip file i posted online and use it in your zip file" attitude. We will not negotiate.
However, I am looking for replacements; the hunt is not going so well for the moment. I like your artsyness but you really shouldn't have polluted the circle_cruiser_2 namespace with it; IF you have stated 'please don't include it because i want users running the latest version' - that i could somehow understand, but this attachment to a set of png files.... heh. grow up.

good job on "turning the tide", that one is also yours right?
EDIT: i just saw your thread, i downloaded your ship from a random website. still, this notice means nothing to me.

@Grognak: props for making the mod manager, its nice work. You do realize that I will waste mine and your time by reuploading the file and editing the first post, and that he will waste your time and spam your inbox by reporting that i still uploaded 'copyrighted' material instead of both of us taking that time ... in a constructive way?

The way I see it, someone will give up or this will get me banned. I have no problems accepting either one of these two outcomes.
Roses are #FF0000
Violets are #0000FF
All of our mods
are belong to you.
VoidInsanity
Posts: 25
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Re: Shark Wars

Postby VoidInsanity » Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:57 pm

Grognak wrote:Hi Shark. Due to a request I have removed the download link from your first post. Please get approval from any individuals you took assets from before re-uploading your mod.

Thanks and feel free to pm me any questions.


Hes gone against your instruction and edited his OP to re-add a link.
Whale Cancer
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Re: Shark Wars

Postby Whale Cancer » Sat Nov 10, 2012 5:45 pm

shark wrote:The way I see it, someone will give up or this will get me banned. I have no problems accepting either one of these two outcomes.


Now the only question is how long until the ban-hammer comes down (will this be the forums first non-spam related ban?).
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EdenNov
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Re: Shark Wars

Postby EdenNov » Sat Nov 10, 2012 6:48 pm

Shark, why don't you just apologize and ask permission? no-one needs to be banned :|
alextfish
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Re: Shark Wars

Postby alextfish » Sat Nov 10, 2012 7:35 pm

Shark, you've been making some interesting discussions over on the Development forum about the commented-out bits of the XML file. And the original parts of this mod are genuinely innovative. I'd like to continue interacting with you to explore the modding capabilities of this game we both enjoy.

Therefore, please, don't get yourself banned. If a guy made up a ship and put the effort into playtesting it and designing the image and gibs, it's fair enough to respect his wishes against redistribution. You've done enough innovative investigations of your own that you really don't need to take credit for other people's work too.

So I'd ask you to go along with the etiquette of this forum, respect the wishes of Grognak our mod, and remove the Obsidian cruiser from your mod; so that you can continue creating your own interesting mods for us to enjoy playing, and I can continue working with you on finding out new and interesting ways to mod this game.
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Kieve
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Re: Shark Wars

Postby Kieve » Sat Nov 10, 2012 7:37 pm

EdenNov wrote:Shark, why don't you just apologize and ask permission? no-one needs to be banned :|

Because he won't be getting it. Which is kind of a shame since there's plenty of other perfectly good modifications here and sinking the whole mod for a single poor decision seems ridiculous to me.

shark wrote:Sometimes I'm glad I'm this stubborn with a thick skin...
@Kieve:
You can get butthurt all you want Kieve, I really appreciate your work but I do not appreciate your 'omg omg you cannot download an image of my ship from a zip file i posted online and use it in your zip file" attitude. We will not negotiate.

However, I am looking for replacements; the hunt is not going so well for the moment. I like your artsyness but you really shouldn't have polluted the circle_cruiser_2 namespace with it; IF you have stated 'please don't include it because i want users running the latest version' - that i could somehow understand, but this attachment to a set of png files.... heh. grow up.


You seem a little confused, so let me be clear: You took my work, did not seek permission or attempt to contact me in any way, altered it as you saw fit, and re-uploaded it with no credit given. I'm not claiming "waah, copyright, boo-hoo-hoo" here, but as the original artist, I have every right to decide how/where my work is used. Finding it on "some random website" doesn't change this in the least. To me, these aren't just "a set of PNGs," this is stuff I took weeks to playtest and perfect, everything from scratch (this was done before any of the ship-editors came out, which means room layouts & alignments were all done manually) - bottom line I put a lot of time and effort into the Obsidian Cruiser mod. Yes I want the users running the latest version - I also want them running the version as I created it, without aftermarket tweaks. And if you take notice of that thread, you'll see there's still a 1.3 version in the works that I'm slowly chugging through (I hate interior sprites).
The attitude of "he can sue me, I'll do what I damn well please" is both insulting and disrespectful - for saying you 'appreciate' my work, you're sure not doing a good job of showing it.

@Grognak: props for making the mod manager, its nice work. You do realize that I will waste mine and your time by reuploading the file and editing the first post, and that he will waste your time and spam your inbox by reporting that i still uploaded 'copyrighted' material instead of both of us taking that time ... in a constructive way?


Let's talk constructive: Remove my Obsidian Cruiser files from your mod, and re-upload without :) Problem solved. As I said, this is non-negotiable, and I'd hate to see the valid original work in this mod get trashed simply because you insist on including this one ship.

alextfish wrote:Shark, you've been making some interesting discussions over on the Development forum about the commented-out bits of the XML file. And the original parts of this mod are genuinely innovative. I'd like to continue interacting with you to explore the modding capabilities of this game we both enjoy.

Therefore, please, don't get yourself banned. If a guy made up a ship and put the effort into playtesting it and designing the image and gibs, it's fair enough to respect his wishes against redistribution. You've done enough innovative investigations of your own that you really don't need to take credit for other people's work too.

So I'd ask you to go along with the etiquette of this forum, respect the wishes of Grognak our mod, and remove the Obsidian cruiser from your mod; so that you can continue creating your own interesting mods for us to enjoy playing, and I can continue working with you on finding out new and interesting ways to mod this game.


Seconded and then some.
See, Shark, I've read some of your other posts. You seem pretty sharp and I wholly respect the innovations you've tried here, testing maxed systems and such. There's a lot of good work in this mod and believe it or not I support that. I don't want to start some stupid feud here and I don't want you banned. I just want you to remove my stuff and stop distributing it as your own.
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Re: Shark Wars

Postby boa13 » Sat Nov 10, 2012 11:53 pm

Whale Cancer wrote:(will this be the forums first non-spam related ban?).

This would actually be the third, if I'm not mistaken. But let's not get to that.
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