What is the point of the Lanius B?

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OC2142
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Re: What is the point of the Lanius B?

Postby OC2142 » Sun Mar 15, 2015 9:40 pm

When you say this ship is a good boarder, tell me, what sort of good boarding ship lacks proper medical facilities. After a battle, your 2 laniuses (Lanii?) are on critical health. They cannot hope to survive the next fight. And you have no way to kill them and force them to clone, so what is the point of this thing?
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stylesrj
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Re: What is the point of the Lanius B?

Postby stylesrj » Sun Mar 15, 2015 9:40 pm

OC2142 wrote:When you say this ship is a good boarder, tell me, what sort of good boarding ship lacks proper medical facilities. After a battle, your 2 laniuses (Lanii?) are on critical health. They cannot hope to survive the next fight. And you have no way to kill them and force them to clone, so what is the point of this thing?


Then you let them die and come back. Or play Mind Control Shield Operator and Cheese It. Or you mind control someone, send them back to your ship and let them choke.

Or if you're lucky (and chances are you will never be) the next encounter will be an automated ship. Put em on it and blow it up. Instant healing!
While Hacking is enjoyable, you need to master Mind Control rather than complain about how bad it is.
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5thHorseman
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Re: What is the point of the Lanius B?

Postby 5thHorseman » Mon Mar 16, 2015 1:19 am

OC2142 wrote:When you say this ship is a good boarder, tell me, what sort of good boarding ship lacks proper medical facilities. After a battle, your 2 laniuses (Lanii?) are on critical health. They cannot hope to survive the next fight. And you have no way to kill them and force them to clone, so what is the point of this thing?


I frequently don't even space my boarders on regular boarding ships with clone bays. I just do one of these things:
  • Reconstructive teleport: Awesome add-on to a boarding clone ship.
  • Upgraded Clone Bay: L3 is awesome but even L2 can heal your boarders fast enough to overcome most problems.
  • Extra boarding crew: With 4 boarders you can cycle teams and spread out the damage, and who wants a teleporting ship with just 2 boarders? So you're going to be doing that anyway. Then fast track L3 teleporter and be even better.
  • Just deal with it: This is a perfectly valid strategy in sectors 1-3, if you've got 2 shields and 4-5 engine power you should be able to take your time in most fights, and with a super awesome flak weapon you can surgically take out weapons on most ships that would give you problems.

Of course, boarding 2 20-health Lanius onto a ship with 5 enemies and a L3 medbay when all you have for backup is an engi and a flak cannon is bad, but if you're still on the starting stuff in sector 6 then any ship is going to have trouble.
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OC2142
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Re: What is the point of the Lanius B?

Postby OC2142 » Tue Mar 17, 2015 12:08 am

Reconstructive Teleport is pretty damned rare and pricey in a shop. Then an L3 medbay needs 4 jumps to heal fully. And extra boarders are hard to come by. If this ship had hacking, it would be hilariously good fun, hacking O2 and then breaking it with 2 laniuses. Admitedly, victory through asphyxiation is rather.... interesting a tactic, but I still prefer the slug method... fire weapons and hack O2. Seriously though, this cruiser has both one of the roughest starts with a flak that can't hit shit all, 2 laniuses who make inferior boarders to Mantii, a 2 man teleporter on a 'boarding' ship and a woefully inferior mind control compared to the hacking system. If anything, the flagship is harder due to the fact you have no hacking system.
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stylesrj
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Re: What is the point of the Lanius B?

Postby stylesrj » Tue Mar 17, 2015 2:06 am

OC2142 wrote:Reconstructive Teleport is pretty damned rare and pricey in a shop. .


But worth it. You want rare, try a Zoltan Shield Bypass for the Basilisk or Carnelian. I swear all those ships who beam intruders onto your Zoltan-shielded ship bought them all up.

Then an L3 medbay needs 4 jumps to heal fully.


Or the destruction of an automated ship.

And extra boarders are hard to come by.


Extra crew is easy to come by. All you need is the two Lanius and Mind Control for boarding. I get two Mantii sometimes. Keep forgetting to swap them out once the Lanius are onboard though.

Seriously though, this cruiser has both one of the roughest starts with a flak that can't hit shit all,


The Advanced Flak is pretty damned accurate actually. You're guaranteed to hit a 4-tile room with it. Even Flak I might miss.

2 laniuses who make inferior boarders to Mantii,


Actually, I think in terms of damage, they're about on par, including the fact that if they get too badly hurt, you beam them away and the crew damage keeps going for a few more seconds. In fact if I had two Mantii on any ship, I'd immediately swap them out for Lanius.

a 2 man teleporter on a 'boarding' ship and a woefully inferior mind control compared to the hacking system.


At least you can counter Mind Control with Mind Control. Hacking uses up a drone and might be shot down.

If anything, the flagship is harder due to the fact you have no hacking system.


Harder? You can steal enemy crew rather than trying to damage their medbay and deal with them that way. I'd say it's a different strategy, not harder. Hacking isn't much of a god if you don't have drone parts. And you'll have plenty of them in the Lanius B because you've been conquering ships rather than trying to spell your name with the Glaive Beam.
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5thHorseman
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Re: What is the point of the Lanius B?

Postby 5thHorseman » Tue Mar 17, 2015 4:53 am

OC2142 wrote:Reconstructive Teleport is pretty damned rare and pricey in a shop.

But it's still an option among many others and very worth it on a clone bay/teleporter ship.

Then an L3 medbay needs 4 jumps to heal fully.

So what? Teleport your 2 Lanius into a 4x4 room. When the 2nd bad guy enters the room, pause the game, hit mind control on the room, and (remove the Lanius from the room that's standing in "slot 1" in the room. The mind controlled guy will go there and fight the only other guy. (then put your guy who's walking out back into an empty square in the room) Your Lanius will then suck the air out of the room and take very little damage for the rest of the fight. You can board with half-healed Laniuses for the vast majority of hte game.

And extra boarders are hard to come by.

Hard to come by? They have their own section in stores! And you can't toss a cat out the airlock without finding easy-to-kill slavers in the first sector, who hand out mantises like candy. I don't know if you're joking or playing a different game than I am. Sure, there are runs where you just don't stumble across people but they're more rare than runs you don't get a Reconstructive Teleport on.

And even disregarding all of this, it has a unique play style. You have to approach it differently. Which is EXACTLY THE POINT OF THE SHIP, to answer the question in this thread's title.
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stylesrj
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Re: What is the point of the Lanius B?

Postby stylesrj » Tue Mar 17, 2015 6:30 am

5thHorseman wrote:And even disregarding all of this, it has a unique play style. You have to approach it differently. Which is EXACTLY THE POINT OF THE SHIP, to answer the question in this thread's title.


But 5th Horseman, that's not a good point! Either it needs to be a gunship or a dedicated boarder! I can't imagine playing any other ship type in the game so this ship sucks because it can't be both. :roll:

On a more serious note, I think what OC means by "Boarders are hard to come by" is that getting extra Lanius is difficult. Captain's Edition puts them in every single boarding event, along with an AI just to mess with your "flush them out" strategy, but vanilla game requires going to the Abandoned Sector. Which might be suicide in Sector 7.

Of course you could just use the Shrike without extra Lanius boarders and instead dedicate a full crew to the needed systems (or my favourite, 4 Zoltans in the shield room, one in piloting and engines and two boarders).

Four-person teleporters are awesome, but you can do very effective boarding strategies with just two.
OC2142
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Re: What is the point of the Lanius B?

Postby OC2142 » Tue Mar 17, 2015 8:33 am

I've only ever seen abandoned sectors at sector 5+, and at 5+ you encounter the dreaded Lanius Bomber, where normal suffocation strategies don't work and you are outnumbered 5 to 4 even with 4 crew half the time. Also, despite not having a teleporter at all, you can fill in the blanks to determine the Shivan (Rock B) is meant to be a boarding ship of flames. It also has a gun on it, and a better one at that. Seriously, that heavy pierce is like an artemis launcher in S1. Sorry Shrike, but she took your job!!
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stylesrj
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Re: What is the point of the Lanius B?

Postby stylesrj » Tue Mar 17, 2015 11:17 am

OC2142 wrote:I've only ever seen abandoned sectors at sector 5+, and at 5+ you encounter the dreaded Lanius Bomber, where normal suffocation strategies don't work and you are outnumbered 5 to 4 even with 4 crew half the time. Also, despite not having a teleporter at all, you can fill in the blanks to determine the Shivan (Rock B) is meant to be a boarding ship of flames. It also has a gun on it, and a better one at that. Seriously, that heavy pierce is like an artemis launcher in S1. Sorry Shrike, but she took your job!!


Could someone tell the Shivian that if they want to keep their job as a good ship, that they bring the teleporter when asked? And for the Grand Basilisk's sake, prepare your weapons slots better man! Seriously, how are people supposed to burn other ships out if you can't do these simple things?

Yes I'm being harsh Shivian, but let's face it. I'm the Carnelian. I'm (the) boss of this hangar. Now excuse me, I'm going to be in a meeting with the Basilisk. We've got an interview with Shrike on that manager position. I heard she's got great potential.
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5thHorseman
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Re: What is the point of the Lanius B?

Postby 5thHorseman » Tue Mar 17, 2015 12:00 pm

The idea that you need a 4-man teleporter for a teleporting ship to be "good" is ridiculous, as well.

A 4-man teleporter doesn't make a good teleporting ship. It makes an OP teleporting fragfest of momentous proportions.
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