Subset Games Forum

I've changed my mind in the past couple days. I think Oxygen is pretty good to get up in case I need to flush out a fire mid battle and need my crew back in there faster to man something.

As I play more ships it's becoming apparent there is no cookie cutter plan that always works. I think I am describing a great plan for Mantis B, but other ships don't have as much to work with and need to focus on offense to keep out of the spiral of trying to repair desperately while getting hammered.

Still, I think having an Engi just in case is important.

Objectively, shields are probably the best thing to get up first since Sector 1 has a lot of lasers.

Dralax wrote:As for the topic itself: it's really a stupid question.

I have gained a lot of valuable input and perspectives from this topic, so it's not stupid a stupid query. However, you're right that upgrades are situational, but that's exactly why the topic analysis shine; it provides the information you need to make beneficial choices to a given situation.

Dralax wrote:

UltraMantis wrote:I think you're right. Not sure what level but it should require a skilled pilot.

Wrong. All you need is piloting subsystem upgraded to lvl 2.

As for the topic itself: it's really a stupid question. With the exception of a few very obvious early choices (get 2 shields if possible, upgrade cloak for stealth cruiser, get medbay for Slug B, upgrade TP for Mantis B, etc.) it's all situational.

That's good to know, I'll make sure upgrade the helm before hitting a bunch of nebula then.

Pepin Short wrote:I've changed my mind in the past couple days. I think Oxygen is pretty good to get up in case I need to flush out a fire mid battle and need my crew back in there faster to man something.

As I play more ships it's becoming apparent there is no cookie cutter plan that always works. I think I am describing a great plan for Mantis B, but other ships don't have as much to work with and need to focus on offense to keep out of the spiral of trying to repair desperately while getting hammered.

Still, I think having an Engi just in case is important.

Objectively, shields are probably the best thing to get up first since Sector 1 has a lot of lasers.

Oxygen upgrades are largely pointless unless you rely on venting to deal with boarders, are coming up on the boss, or going through a lot of slug nebula. You can easily open nearby doors and flush rooms with Oxygen.

MC3craze wrote:Oxygen upgrades are largely pointless unless you rely on venting to deal with boarders, are coming up on the boss, or going through a lot of slug nebula. You can easily open nearby doors and flush rooms with Oxygen.

What is pointless about having a more damage resistant oxygen system? Also, have you noticed how much faster just one upgrade is at refilling your ship? Finally, Slugs will be less likely to completely shut off the system if it's upgraded.

UltraMantis wrote:What is pointless about having a more damage resistant oxygen system? Also, have you noticed how much faster just one upgrade is at refilling your ship? Finally, Slugs will be less likely to completely shut off the system if it's upgraded.

The damage resilience is why I don't upgrade it until the boss, or at least close to sector 8. I can usually pull a crewmember over there or at the very least hold out until the fight is over. I find there are better things to spend scrap on at the beginning.

The slug protection and refill boost are situational in my opinion. I will upgrade O2 if I find myself venting a lot, or seeing a sector path full of nebula.

UltraMantis wrote:What is pointless about having a more damage resistant oxygen system? Also, have you noticed how much faster just one upgrade is at refilling your ship? Finally, Slugs will be less likely to completely shut off the system if it's upgraded.

Thing is you don't need damage resistant oxygen system. Unless you are fighting something that you can barely hurt (eg. you have 4 points of lasers and enemy has 3 shields), you can take care of O₂after the combat as long as you keep it near 100% before getting into a fight. I find that way too many people are irrationally scared of having O₂ offline for more than 5 seconds.

Dralax wrote:I find that way too many people are irrationally scared of having O₂ offline for more than 5 seconds.

I agree. I only deal with the oxygen level between fights, otherwise I treat the power bar as part of the available reactor supply. Oxygen don't win fights for you, it just keeps you alive in between.

The thing about upgrades is that those that directly improve defense or attack capabilities also improve the probability of survival in the long run, while the other upgrades that are somewhat ad hoc. While it's comfortable to have a fully upgraded MedBay, it only shines if you have a lonely engi that has to fend off four boarders alone. Aside from such rare instances, the basic MedBay perform well enough to last through an entire run. Likewise a fully upgraded oxygen system will only be a benefit if several hull breaches threatens your last standing mantis with asphyxiation. The net gain in survivability for investment in support systems is minuscule compared to upgrades in direct offensive and/or defensive capabilities.

The possible gain from blue options are however a good case to partially upgrade support systems, if you know a given event are likely to occur when entering a sector.

I completely disagree about auxilliary upgrades being pointless or ad hoc. Maximum upgrades may well be a luxury, but level 2 upgrades are too effective to be ignored. I will frequently grab them early and frequently they will turn out to be very usefull.

Oxygen level 2:
- cheap
- refills oxygen at a very fast rate (abuse this)
- pumps air into breached rooms fast enough to prevent your crew from taking any suffocation damage
- takes 2 pts. of damage to disable (consider melee attacks and fire before saying it's bullshit)
- isn't likely to be hacked offline

Medbay level 2:
- still fairly cheap
- heals crew fast enough to repell dangerous intruders
- heals boarding parties faster in case they need to make another attack
- isn't likely to be hacked offline
- this is just a personal thing but slow healing bores me enough that i'd pay 35 scrap to speed it up
- doesn't use power during combat in most cases

Doors level 2:
- cheap
- takes 2 pts. of damage to disable (consider melee attacks and fire before saying it's bullshit)
- slows down intruders (which is fairly useless unless you can suffocate them a bit)

Autopilot level 2:
- takes 2 pts. of damage to disable
- the ship stops if piloting is knocked offline. odds are this will happen with missiles or power surges about to beat you to death

Compare level 2 performance to level 1 and consider the cost. You can manage without but it will not be as safe, and FTL has plenty of good runs cuts short by the rng exploiting a weakness. Why carry such a weakness in the first place? It's not paranoia, it's staying one step ahead of trouble if possible.
Doors are the only system without much benefit but it's also the cheapest one. I vent a lot and i get stuck doors a lot as well. Depending of room layout repairing this system can be extremly lethal. I'd agree it's situational though.

UltraMantis wrote:Compare level 2 performance to level 1 and consider the cost. You can manage without but it will not be as safe, and FTL has plenty of good runs cuts short by the rng exploiting a weakness. Why carry such a weakness in the first place? It's not paranoia, it's staying one step ahead of trouble if possible.

I agree that it's better to be safe than sorry, but if you take out your enemy before it can score a critical hit, then the notion of troublesome disappear entirely.