Exactly what does the stealth ship have to reccomend it?

General discussion about the game.
Burius81
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Joined: Fri Sep 14, 2012 7:50 pm

Re: Exactly what does the stealth ship have to reccomend it?

Postby Burius81 » Mon Sep 17, 2012 10:29 pm

I like the play style of the ship but the weapon/drone slots do feel kind of gimped. By that I mean at the beginning it is pretty close in power to any other ship but having 3/2 weapon/drone slots hurts toward the end. All of the other ships I have unlocked have 4/2 or 3/3.

Would it hurt to raise one or the other?
TJJ
Posts: 88
Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2012 5:06 pm

Re: Exactly what does the stealth ship have to reccomend it?

Postby TJJ » Mon Sep 17, 2012 10:33 pm

Evasion is a strength multiplier for both shields and hull.

Evasion is not a strength multiplier for cloak; hence a straight swap of shield for cloak is obviously going to result in a weaker ship.

Note I'm not advocating the stealth ship be improved.
I think it's weaker by design, so that players have an additional level of challenge once they've mastered the more conventional ships.
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icepick
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Re: Exactly what does the stealth ship have to reccomend it?

Postby icepick » Mon Sep 17, 2012 10:37 pm

Stealth isn't a guaranteed miss. Evasion is still a "multiplier" for the stealth.
Maze1125
Posts: 144
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Re: Exactly what does the stealth ship have to reccomend it?

Postby Maze1125 » Mon Sep 17, 2012 10:46 pm

icepick wrote:Stealth isn't a guaranteed miss. Evasion is still a "multiplier" for the stealth.


No, it isn't.
Evasion simply adds to stealth, it doesn't multiply with it. That distinction is very important.

Edit: Although, that doesn't necessarily make it weaker. The main reason stealth is weaker than shields is that shields are active all the time, while the cloak cannot be.
liq3
Posts: 14
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2012 10:25 pm

Re: Exactly what does the stealth ship have to reccomend it?

Postby liq3 » Mon Sep 17, 2012 10:55 pm

The biggest advantage imo is the long range scanner. It lets you avoid things like asteroid fields, ion storms, etc etc and even avoid battles if your hull is low.

You can drop most weapons early before the even hit you. Just shoot at weapons, followed by a mini-beam on weapons. You use stealth to avoid the first volley. Drones really hurt, so one of the first things I go for is shields. Don't need a lot, just one level.

Yeh, long scanner + stealth is why'd you pick it. If you don't like those, pick another ship.
TJJ
Posts: 88
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Re: Exactly what does the stealth ship have to reccomend it?

Postby TJJ » Mon Sep 17, 2012 11:08 pm

One avenue to explore....

Without shields, there's little reason to focus on evasion.

So....

Sacrifice evasion entirely, and go for a purely offensive alpha-strike build.
By re-purposing the power you'd ordinarily reserve for shields/evasion you can quite quickly get up to lvl 8 weapons; especially if you sell your 2 starting augs.

Add an elite weapons officer and a weapon reloader, and you can alpha-strike twice before the enemy has a chance to return fire.
Beyond that, a weapon preignitor pushes you up to 3 alpha-strikes.
Stealth weapons could make it 4 alpha-strikes before you have to face any return fire.

4 attacks with the right set of lvl 8 weapons (multi-shot lasers) is enough to kill anything; even the boss.

Of course this depends on getting useful weapon & aug upgrades, but it'd maintain the flavour of the ship rather than falling back on the generic 'get a shield generator' option.
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Eyjio
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Re: Exactly what does the stealth ship have to reccomend it?

Postby Eyjio » Mon Sep 17, 2012 11:28 pm

Here's what you lose from the Kestral:
-1 gun slot
-1 drone slot
-Shields
-1 weapons power
-Missile launcher
-Burst laser

Here's what you gain:
-Long range scanner
-Titanium alloy (mitigating 15% of all hull damage is a win)
-Cloaking device
-3 engine power
-1 extra sensor bar
-Beam weapon
-Most energy efficient laser in the game (it's a burst mk I that only uses 1 power and charges faster)

They're just totally different ships. When cloaked with an unleveled pilot and engine attendant, you have 75% evasion. That's amazing, especially when the enemy can't charge their weapons in that time. By cloaking immediately, then dual laser/mini beaming the enemy weapons, you can get 2-3 attacks in before they can even fire. You can avoid asteroid fields and suns. It's a ship built around dodging and striking when your enemy can't. I vastly prefer it to the Kestral which always felt a bit like a jack of all trades in a game where you needed to specialise.
TJJ
Posts: 88
Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2012 5:06 pm

Re: Exactly what does the stealth ship have to reccomend it?

Postby TJJ » Mon Sep 17, 2012 11:46 pm

Eyjio wrote:Here's what you lose from the Kestral:
-1 gun slot
-1 drone slot
-Shields
-1 weapons power
-Missile launcher
-Burst laser

Here's what you gain:
-Long range scanner
-Titanium alloy (mitigating 15% of all hull damage is a win)
-Cloaking device
-3 engine power
-1 extra sensor bar
-Beam weapon
-Most energy efficient laser in the game (it's a burst mk I that only uses 1 power and charges faster)

They're just totally different ships. When cloaked with an unleveled pilot and engine attendant, you have 75% evasion. That's amazing, especially when the enemy can't charge their weapons in that time. By cloaking immediately, then dual laser/mini beaming the enemy weapons, you can get 2-3 attacks in before they can even fire. You can avoid asteroid fields and suns. It's a ship built around dodging and striking when your enemy can't. I vastly prefer it to the Kestral which always felt a bit like a jack of all trades in a game where you needed to specialise.


I think the problem is the shield-less alpha-strike strategy doesn't scale.
It's fine for the first 3-4 sectors, but once you are facing enemies that cannot be killed or disabled by your alpha-strike (strong cloakers, heavy droners, and energy shields) your glass cannon build becomes suicidal.

At that point you fall back to the main-stream builds, and your ship loses its unique flavour.
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Eyjio
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Re: Exactly what does the stealth ship have to reccomend it?

Postby Eyjio » Mon Sep 17, 2012 11:53 pm

Even so, you're still left with an amazing augmentation and a great gun. I would also argue that the reason it resembles other builds is because cloaking is just incredibly powerful - almost every ship will want to buy it. The stealth ship will outperform the Kestral on an evade/shield heavy build, simply because it starts with a cloak and high engines, plus the titanium augment can literally save you against the final boss. So whilst it may seem less unique, I think that's more due to the fact that cloaking is just so amazing against the power surge that most builds will pick it up.
Vigilant
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Re: Exactly what does the stealth ship have to reccomend it?

Postby Vigilant » Mon Sep 17, 2012 11:57 pm

The start is a little bit difficult, especially enemies with beam weapons are a great pain in the §"% without shield und cloaking device on cooldown. But after that phase with the right gear it´s quite fun.

Give it a try. Not an easy to play ship, but later a real Bird Of Prey :twisted:.

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