Just beat the boss on easy. It was easy. :P

General discussion about the game.
Maze1125
Posts: 144
Joined: Sun May 20, 2012 12:09 pm

Re: Just beat the boss on easy. It was easy. :P

Postby Maze1125 » Sun Sep 16, 2012 8:24 am

RynCage wrote:
Maze1125 wrote:
RynCage wrote:Everything leading up to the bossfight is very solid. You need approach your choices, and the combat strategicly. the bossfight on the otherhand, is "hope you can do enough DPS because <unavoidable attack here> [unless you have cloak, a 2 in one gearcheck.]" You can't sit there and tell me it isn't completely cheesey.


But you don't need a cloak. It's quite possible to survive both super-weapons without a scratch without a cloak. You'll probably need max shields or max evade instead, but that doesn't make it a "gear-check" as those are the 3 defensive measures that exist in the game.

The boss has no gear-check at all. Whatever strategy you choose to play the game with, you can beat the boss with, provided you have enough of it. Yes, if you attack the boss with a single burst laser and no teleport, then you're going to lose, but that's just like any other roguelike, or any other role playing game for that matter, if you try and fight the final boss with equipment from the first couple of areas, you're not going to win. I don't know why people are finding that a surprise.


Are you confused about what a gearcheck is? You're telling me it isnt a gearcheck, then explaining about how its a complete gearcheck.
Also, you can buy cloak for 150, no need to upgrade it because it lasts long enough to bypass either of the bosses "super" attacks.
Or spend roughly 675 scrap [give or take which starting ship you use] for those max sheilds and evade instead.
Yes, 3 completely viable defensive measures obviously. Oh, and you also need enough DPS or your just wasting time with the whole survivability thing.
I understand you shouldnt be able to beat the boss with a starting loadout, But i never said thats what i expected to be the case to begin with.


Okay, then give a game that has an inventory and, by your definition, doesn't have a "gearcheck".

Seriously, you don't need a cloak, you don't need max shields, you don't need max evade, you don't need missiles, you don't need a teleport, you don't need lasers and you don't need drones.

Where the hell is this supposed "gearcheck"?!?
Maze1125
Posts: 144
Joined: Sun May 20, 2012 12:09 pm

Re: Just beat the boss on easy. It was easy. :P

Postby Maze1125 » Sun Sep 16, 2012 8:26 am

RynCage wrote:For all intents and purposes, Scrap is "gear".


Er..., no, scrap is money. Money that you spend on gear.

And if you end up spending all your money on repairs, rather than gear, that suggests you should be trying to take less damage during the game, rather than blaming the final boss because your squandered your money.
RynCage
Posts: 25
Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2012 8:25 am

Re: Just beat the boss on easy. It was easy. :P

Postby RynCage » Sun Sep 16, 2012 8:28 am

well sorry you still dont understand, But i can't possibly dumb it down any further for you.
We'll just leave it at that.
Maze1125
Posts: 144
Joined: Sun May 20, 2012 12:09 pm

Re: Just beat the boss on easy. It was easy. :P

Postby Maze1125 » Sun Sep 16, 2012 8:31 am

RynCage wrote:well sorry you still dont understand, But i can't possibly dumb it down any further for you.
We'll just leave it at that.


I didn't ask you to dumb it down, I asked you to give a single other game that fitted your criteria, something you're obviously incapable of doing.
ShadowDragon8685
Posts: 75
Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2012 3:45 am

Re: Just beat the boss on easy. It was easy. :P

Postby ShadowDragon8685 » Sun Sep 16, 2012 8:55 am

Maze1125 wrote:Seriously, you don't need a cloak, you don't need max shields, you don't need max evade, you don't need missiles, you don't need a teleport, you don't need lasers and you don't need drones.

Where the hell is this supposed "gearcheck"?!?


You don't need all of them, surely. In fact, past a certain point, having more of them does not help you because you don't have enough power to use them all at once.

But you damn well do need enough of them to form a coherent battle strategy to apply, and they need not to just be a coherent battle strategy, they need to be sufficiently strong enough to work.


And therein lies the Gearcheck; just like the MMORPGs the term is spawned from, you don't necessarily need all of your gear to be of the appropriate level to beat the gear-check boss; heck, you could probably do it without a helmet and pantsless, if the rest of your gear is equal to or superiorto the level of gear you're supposed to have when you fight the boss.

But, if you don't have enough to do your thing, you're gonna get squashed. Therein lies the gear-check: it's not a check to see that you have somehow managed to upgrade everything to max, it's simply unwinnable if you're sufficiently undergeared.

The problem therein lies in the fact that with the RNG being what it is, it's entirely possible to make it all the way to the boss on gear that's vastly understrength for what is necessary to actually beat the boss, making defeat a foregone conclusion, on top of other loss conditions that make victory an uncertain conclusion, even if you're rocking the best of everything.
Frustrated by random things beyond your control killing you?

Maxim 31: only cheaters prosper.
Maze1125
Posts: 144
Joined: Sun May 20, 2012 12:09 pm

Re: Just beat the boss on easy. It was easy. :P

Postby Maze1125 » Sun Sep 16, 2012 9:02 am

ShadowDragon8685 wrote:
Maze1125 wrote:Seriously, you don't need a cloak, you don't need max shields, you don't need max evade, you don't need missiles, you don't need a teleport, you don't need lasers and you don't need drones.

Where the hell is this supposed "gearcheck"?!?


You don't need all of them, surely. In fact, past a certain point, having more of them does not help you because you don't have enough power to use them all at once.

But you damn well do need enough of them to form a coherent battle strategy to apply, and they need not to just be a coherent battle strategy, they need to be sufficiently strong enough to work.


And therein lies the Gearcheck; just like the MMORPGs the term is spawned from, you don't necessarily need all of your gear to be of the appropriate level to beat the gear-check boss; heck, you could probably do it without a helmet and pantsless, if the rest of your gear is equal to or superiorto the level of gear you're supposed to have when you fight the boss.

But, if you don't have enough to do your thing, you're gonna get squashed. Therein lies the gear-check: it's not a check to see that you have somehow managed to upgrade everything to max, it's simply unwinnable if you're sufficiently undergeared.


Well, yes, obviously. As said, pretty much every game with an inventory is like that. You need equipment strong enough to fight the final boss, or you can't beat him.

The problem therein lies in the fact that with the RNG being what it is, it's entirely possible to make it all the way to the boss on gear that's vastly understrength for what is necessary to actually beat the boss, making defeat a foregone conclusion, on top of other loss conditions that make victory an uncertain conclusion, even if you're rocking the best of everything.


I don't feel blaming that entirely on the RNG is fair. If you make a bad decision in a fight and have to spend a load of scrap on repairs, that's your fault, not the RNG's.

Yes, you need enough scrap to beat the final boss, so make sure to make decisions through the game so that you get, and keep, that scrap. If you fail to make the right decisions, then that's not the RNG's fault.
Yeah, sometimes the RNG will make the game harder, and sometimes easier, but that doesn't mean it ever gave you an unwinnable game.
ShadowDragon8685
Posts: 75
Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2012 3:45 am

Re: Just beat the boss on easy. It was easy. :P

Postby ShadowDragon8685 » Sun Sep 16, 2012 9:09 am

Maze1125 wrote:Well, yes, obviously. As said, pretty much every game with an inventory is like that. You need equipment strong enough to fight the final boss, or you can't beat him.


Yes, but in World of Warcraft, if the RNG hasn't blessed you with gear strong enough to begin raiding (very likely that it hasn't,) you can chain Heroics until enough to begin raiding drops, whereas FTL throws you right at the end boss come hell or high water.


I don't feel blaming that entirely on the RNG is fair. If you make a bad decision in a fight and have to spend a load of scrap on repairs, that's your fault, not the RNG's.

Yes, you need enough scrap to beat the final boss, so make sure to make decisions through the game so that you get, and keep, that scrap. If you fail to make the right decisions, then that's not the RNG's fault.
Yeah, sometimes the RNG will make the game harder, and sometimes easier, but that doesn't mean it ever gave you an unwinnable game.


You keep harping on "decisions," much like the people who have a vested interest in ensuring that corporations remain unaccountable for the horrible things they unleash upon the people harp upon "personal responsibility." But the fact remains that it's not just all down to the decisions you make. You can make every "right" decision and still be screwed if the game doesn't drop good enough gear, or if it decides to drop drones like mad and you never managed to find a drone controller while you had enough scrap on-hand to buy it.

Without checks to ensure the game is dropping enough (getting more generous if you're doing poorly or under-equipped,) or sometimes due to plain dumb luck (such as if you somehow manage to almost never pull into a store and consequently don't get a chance to stock up,) the game may well be unwinnable.
Frustrated by random things beyond your control killing you?

Maxim 31: only cheaters prosper.
Maze1125
Posts: 144
Joined: Sun May 20, 2012 12:09 pm

Re: Just beat the boss on easy. It was easy. :P

Postby Maze1125 » Sun Sep 16, 2012 9:18 am

ShadowDragon8685 wrote:You can make every "right" decision and still be screwed if the game doesn't drop good enough gear,


Ya know, people say that a lot, but I've seen nothing that proves it ever really happens.

Yes, theoretically, the game can produce an unwinnable game, but what's the actual occurrence rate? Have you ever calculated it? Or are you just basing your complaints on a few games where you reached an unwinnable situation in the end? And if you are, can you honestly say you never made a single mistake in those games, and you know every strategy that can be executed in the game and can do them all perfectly and pick the most likely to be successful without fail?
Jtotheosh
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2012 10:05 am

Re: Just beat the boss on easy. It was easy. :P

Postby Jtotheosh » Sun Sep 16, 2012 10:11 am

Yea I thought it was going to be easy I beat the first stage with the engi ship no problem(2 hull repair drones, and the weapon was 2 breach missile 2's) and then when i got to the drone part of the battle where the ship escaped. It destroyed me no question I didn't even get to do 1 damage to him, any suggestions for next time?
Maze1125
Posts: 144
Joined: Sun May 20, 2012 12:09 pm

Re: Just beat the boss on easy. It was easy. :P

Postby Maze1125 » Sun Sep 16, 2012 10:18 am

Jtotheosh wrote:Yea I thought it was going to be easy I beat the first stage with the engi ship no problem(2 hull repair drones, and the weapon was 2 breach missile 2's) and then when i got to the drone part of the battle where the ship escaped. It destroyed me no question I didn't even get to do 1 damage to him, any suggestions for next time?


Make sure to take out his weapons first, and have upgraded doors to slow down the boarding drone, if you can then take out the drone bay, that reduces the damage the drone swarm can muster. A cloak is awesome for the swarm too.

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