Flagship Randomizer 1.29 for AE, ACE and ACE Infinite

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NarnKar
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Re: [Beta Phase] Flagship Randomizer 0.6 for CE

Postby NarnKar » Fri Sep 12, 2014 1:22 pm

Rolled another few flagships, just to test the probabilities. All of these were done with 0.6, obviously.

Code: Select all

Flagship 6
Main Guns: Burst Laser, Breach Missile
Secondary Guns: Burst Laser, Light Beam
Flagship 7
Main Guns: Dual Hull Missile, Dual Heavy Laser
Secondary Guns: Dual Hull Missile, Burst Laser
Flagship 8
Main Guns: Breach Missile, Burst Laser
Secondary Guns: Hull Laser, Fire Beam
Flagship 9
Main Guns: Dual Heavy Laser, Hull Laser
Secondary Guns: Hull Beam, Burst Ion Gun


Lots of lasers and missiles; three beams, and one ion gun. (Just the one!)
rannl
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Re: [Beta Phase] Flagship Randomizer 0.6 for CE

Postby rannl » Fri Sep 12, 2014 1:30 pm

NarnKar wrote:Rolled another few flagships, just to test the probabilities. All of these were done with 0.6, obviously.

Code: Select all

Flagship 6
Main Guns: Burst Laser, Breach Missile
Secondary Guns: Burst Laser, Light Beam
Flagship 7
Main Guns: Dual Hull Missile, Dual Heavy Laser
Secondary Guns: Dual Hull Missile, Burst Laser
Flagship 8
Main Guns: Breach Missile, Burst Laser
Secondary Guns: Hull Laser, Fire Beam
Flagship 9
Main Guns: Dual Heavy Laser, Hull Laser
Secondary Guns: Hull Beam, Burst Ion Gun


Lots of lasers and missiles; three beams, and one ion gun. (Just the one!)


Another point to consider - the more weapons a specific type has, the more likely this weapon type will be selected. There are a lot more laser/missile type weapons then ion/beam type weapons, especially with the AE build. So that explains your results, NK.
Nider_01
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Re: [Beta Phase] Flagship Randomizer 0.6 for CE

Postby Nider_01 » Fri Sep 12, 2014 3:01 pm

Hmm. What about another version of this mod without options to read the secret data? I want some challenge! :twisted:
rannl
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Re: [Beta Phase] Flagship Randomizer 0.6 for CE

Postby rannl » Fri Sep 12, 2014 3:49 pm

Nider_01 wrote:Hmm. What about another version of this mod without options to read the secret data? I want some challenge! :twisted:


Seems like you just want more buttons on the GUI ;)
Build dependent generation will get more features, so if Sleepy is OK with this, I bet we can squeeze a "No Info on Flagship" switch to the tool.
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Estel
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Re: [Beta Phase] Flagship Randomizer 0.6 for CE

Postby Estel » Fri Sep 12, 2014 5:09 pm

rannl, would it be possible to add another rule apart from "at least", etc, namely "chance", with argument like 2x, 3x, etc? Thsi way, you could hardcode higher chances for certain weapon types, espcially the ones, that have small pool. So, if we have (just made numbers up) a 12 lasers and 6 ions, we could give ions 2x priority for the 3th and 4th weapon, evening the chances.

With current rules, I don't see how we could, effectively, boost chances of things like ion, without ensuring, that 3th and 4th weapon draw only from ion/beam/nhd. We *want* to have (relatively small) chance of laser-only or missile-only or mixed hull-damaging only flagship, from time to time - but, at the same time, it would be great to see more ions and other under-represented weapons.

Cheers,
/Estel
Russian Rockman
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Re: [Beta Phase] Flagship Randomizer 0.6 for CE

Postby Russian Rockman » Fri Sep 12, 2014 7:07 pm

I like Estel's idea. ;)

I also just wanted to reiterate that, while I do like the challenge of an all missiles (btw does that include flaks?) and lasers flagship, more variety is always better. It would really be a shame if all your neat new ion and beam weapons were rarely used. And I think there was a reason the devs made the flagship have 4 different types.

I approve of ensuring that the flagship is always somewhat difficult by ensuring that the main guns are always hull damaging weapons. But like you said, this makes it more statistically likely to have missiles and laser weapons. I'm not sure you should make the secondary weapons only draw from the ion and beam pool, though that is a possibility. But as long as you can make it so that all weapons and types have an equal chance of appearing I'd be happy. :)

If I understand correctly though... All of the limitations on choosing weapons are handled by the .xml anyway so we could tweak the setting ourselves if we wanted. Estel's idea is nice though because it could help ensure that we always have a variety of weapons.
Last edited by Russian Rockman on Fri Sep 12, 2014 7:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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NarnKar
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Re: [Beta Phase] Flagship Randomizer 0.6 for CE

Postby NarnKar » Fri Sep 12, 2014 7:09 pm

Nider_01 wrote:Hmm. What about another version of this mod without options to read the secret data? I want some challenge! :twisted:


You could always just press "continue" instead of reading the data.
rannl
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Re: [Beta Phase] Flagship Randomizer 0.6 for CE

Postby rannl » Fri Sep 12, 2014 7:27 pm

Estel : sure, a "chance" or "weight" could be added as a rule, making all weapon types of a specified group have an extra chance to be selected. Another thought is to add this to specific weapons, but with a negative value, i.e. making weapons more rare. This way we could add some nasty surprises which might pop up once in a while :twisted:

So to sum up the comments : we want the main guns to be lasers or missiles, and we want the secondary weapons to be selected from all possible weapons, with a significant chance increase for getting ion/beam weapons.
If this is the case and you want to test it out, we can use the current tool and change the assets (i.e. create copies of the ion/beam weapons in order to make them more likely to appear), creating a new version with the desired randomized content.
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Estel
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Re: [Beta Phase] Flagship Randomizer 0.6 for CE

Postby Estel » Fri Sep 12, 2014 9:38 pm

rannl wrote:Estel : sure, a "chance" or "weight" could be added as a rule, making all weapon types of a specified group have an extra chance to be selected. Another thought is to add this to specific weapons, but with a negative value, i.e. making weapons more rare. This way we could add some nasty surprises which might pop up once in a while :twisted:


Very good idea :) Some rare (crystal&co) batteries on flagship, from time to time, would be a nice touch.

rannl wrote:If this is the case and you want to test it out, we can use the current tool and change the assets (i.e. create copies of the ion/beam weapons in order to make them more likely to appear), creating a new version with the desired randomized content.


Yea, thought about that, I just think that making the "weight" a parameter would be better in the long run :)

/Estel
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NarnKar
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Re: [Beta Phase] Flagship Randomizer 0.6 for CE

Postby NarnKar » Sat Sep 13, 2014 1:41 am

While I'm in support of this idea, I defer to Sleeper Service's judgement.

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